Bill C. from Torrance, CA at Trudgers AA Speaker Meeting – Phoenix, AZ 6/2/2003

(0:08 – 0:20)
Bill Alcoholic? I have a tie. I brought a jacket, too. But it’s too goddamn hot.
(0:25 – 0:31)
It’s really nice to be here. Get to hook up with my old buddy, Rick. Haven’t seen him in a
long time.
(0:32 – 0:40)
You know, I don’t have much of a story. When I started drinking, my life kind of stopped.
But I have a lot of opinions.
(0:41 – 0:50)
So I’d like to talk to you tonight a little bit about where we are. Where I think we are. This
AA thing, you know, what it’s about, why we’re here.
(0:50 – 1:04)
Give you some opinions about that. I always find it pleasurable when a speaker will get
up and quit trying to pretend to be humble and tell you what he thinks about what the
hell’s going on. Because this is by far the most interesting thing that’s ever happened to
me in my life.
(1:04 – 1:10)
Getting sober. Everything else pales in comparison. The change.
(1:10 – 1:19)
I don’t know about you, but I’m conscious of the fact that my life got saved. That’s a
pretty bizarre experience. It doesn’t happen to just anybody, you know.
(1:20 – 1:27)
There’s lots of people that are paying good money to try to get awakened. It just
happens to us. No charge.
(1:28 – 1:37)
All you got to do is act like a fool for 10 or 15, 20 years. God says, well, how about him?
He looks good. Let’s wake his ass up.
(1:38 – 1:45)
See what happens. Should be interesting. Here we all sit in AA.
(1:48 – 2:00)
I was a surfer and a biker and a tough guy. And I never went to the beach. My
motorcycle rarely ran.
(2:01 – 2:07)
And I was afraid to fight. But I looked really good. I looked good.
(2:07 – 2:15)
I had a chrome Nazi helmet for a hat and a primary chain for a belt. Black greasy Levi’s,
big black boots with chains around them. I’ve got tattoos all over me.
(2:16 – 2:35)
I had a clip-on earring because I didn’t want to hurt myself. So like most of you, I was full
of shit. Oh, come on.
(2:35 – 2:41)
Isn’t it true? Really. We’re out there pretending. We’re trying to be something.
(2:42 – 2:54)
We’ve never been anything real most of our lives, don’t you think? Another thing you’ll
notice tonight, I have no problem speaking for you. I figure you’re just like me. And that’s
been my experience, is that we’re all pretty much alike.
(2:55 – 3:00)
We like to think we’re unique. But there’s a common thread that runs through it. One of
them is being full of shit.
(3:03 – 3:09)
Alcoholics, that’s a general thing. I’m trying to pretend to be something. I want to be part
of something.
(3:09 – 3:23)
But I have a very difficult time staying in the group or being accepted by the group.
Another weird thing happened to me when I was very young. Is when I was six years old,
my dad got sober.
(3:24 – 3:34)
He died in 1999. He was 45 years sober. So I grew up in AA, in the 50s and 60s.
(3:34 – 3:41)
I grew up in AA. When it was really exploding on the West Coast. It was a real fascinating
time.
(3:42 – 3:57)
My father went to his first meeting in March of 54. It was March the 29th. I got sober on
March the 28th of 85.
(3:57 – 4:05)
So we gave each other cakes for 15 years. At the Hermosa Beach Men’s Stag, my home
group. In Hermosa Beach on Monday nights.
(4:07 – 4:15)
On March the 29th, he went to his first meeting. And he came home that night. And he
told my mother, those people have got something down there.
(4:15 – 4:30)
I’m going to go back and find out what it is. So on March the 30th, when he went to his
second meeting, my mother went with him in order to monitor the experience.
Fortunately, some women grabbed her and drug her off to an Al-Anon meeting.
(4:33 – 4:42)
She helped form the Al-Anon central office of the inner group in Los Angeles. We hung
around with Chuck Chamberlain and people like that. That’s who was sober then.
(4:42 – 4:50)
That was before they were icons. My mother’s archive, she died last year. She was 48
years in Al-Anon.
(4:51 – 4:57)
There were letters from Lois Wilson. That’s what was cooking. They were building
Alcoholics Anonymous.
(4:57 – 5:05)
They were starting meetings. I grew up in a house where the big books were open. A lot
of people grew up in houses where they were coasters.
(5:05 – 5:15)
A lot of big books out there with rings on them. These people actually believed it. They
bought the whole package.
(5:15 – 5:23)
This was before the hospitals had figured out how to make money out of us. So when
you went on a 12-step call, you brought them home. There was nowhere else to take
them.
(5:24 – 5:32)
There were no halfway houses. Hospitals wouldn’t take them. Hospitals are for sick
people, not for people with moral weaknesses like alcoholics.
(5:33 – 5:53)
So I have a lot of memories of being watching television in the living room and having to
leave when the old man brought some guy back drunk and him and another guy
pounded on the book and pointed their finger at him and told him the same lame-ass
shit we tell him today. Not much has changed. The message of Alcoholics Anonymous is
pretty much the same as it always was.
(5:53 – 6:00)
There’s a lot of psychobabble that’s come into it. The psychotherapeutic community has
added a lot to AA. Some of it’s really good.
(6:00 – 6:14)
And some of it’s extremely deadly. There’s a couple of lies that you’ll hear around here
that can get you drunk. One of them is, you’ve got to learn to love yourself before you
can love others.
(6:15 – 6:23)
That’ll pretty much kill you. I mean, all I’ve ever been doing is loving me. You know,
getting me off.
(6:24 – 6:36)
That’s all I’ve ever been interested in is getting off. Billy needs to feel better now. So if
you wait around for me to think about loving me, you’re going to wait a long time for me
to show up for you.
(6:40 – 6:49)
Another one is, you’ve been your own worst enemy. Put yourself at the top of the
amends list. That’ll kill you.
(6:51 – 7:01)
I was not my own worst enemy. I was yours. No one gets to AA with a whole lot of selfesteem.
(7:02 – 7:10)
No one. If you want to make amends to yourself, put yourself at the bottom of the list. By
the time you get there, you’ll have some self-esteem.
(7:11 – 7:26)
You want to make amends to yourself? Make amends to others. Another really good one
is that there’s a different program for everyone in AA. That was made up by an alcoholic
that doesn’t want to work the program.
(7:27 – 7:35)
Because there’s only one. I think there should be a special one for Billy. But there’s only
one.
(7:35 – 7:44)
And it’s pretty clear what it is. We don’t want to do it. We want to pick and choose what
we will and won’t do, just like we did most of our lives.
(7:47 – 8:00)
I’d come home from school and there’d be some guy sitting on the back porch waiting
for his sponsor to come home. Sometimes they were drunk, sometimes they were sober.
One day I came home from school, there was a woman hiding in the garage.
(8:01 – 8:14)
That was the Al-Anon. Al-Anon people are strange. Don’t make Al-Anon jokes if you don’t
know what it’s about.
(8:15 – 8:25)
I think I know what it’s about. I’ve been to it and I’ve grown up around it. When my
mother died just last year, she was in the living room of my house her last few months.
(8:26 – 8:32)
And I was surrounded by the Al-Anon people. They’re angels. But stop and think about it.
(8:32 – 8:49)
Who would live with us consciously? Who makes up the decision after a few years, Oh,
this is fun, I think I’ll stick around. There’s something wrong with them. That’s why
there’s a program for them.
(8:53 – 9:03)
There was a guy that became like a member of our house. There was actually a few, but
this one guy in particular, Harold, was a cabinetmaker. And he was a bad drunk.
(9:03 – 9:11)
And my dad would give him jobs to do around the house and try to help him out. And he
kept slipping and going in and out. And finally he got sober.
(9:12 – 9:19)
And he met a woman in AA and they got married. And I went to the wedding. And then
Harold got drunk again.
(9:20 – 9:28)
And he got divorced. And he burned himself up alive in his bed, drunk, smoking. And I
went to the funeral.
(9:29 – 9:37)
This was all before I ever started drinking. So I knew what AA looked like. I knew it wasn’t
just a bunch of old people hanging on to each other, not drinking.
(9:38 – 9:50)
You know, I’d been to the parties and the roundups and the barbecues and the potlucks.
And most of them, as I look back now, what they were, a lot of them were planning
meetings, where they were starting other meetings. They were trying to connect the
dots.
(9:51 – 10:02)
In the LA basin now, there’s over 3,000 meetings a week. In the South Bay area where I
live, there’s over 300 per week. Back then, that is not what was going on.
(10:02 – 10:12)
These are the people that helped Alcoholics Anonymous grow. These were the soldiers.
And a lot of what they were doing was plotting and planning where they were going to
go next, how they were going to build it.
(10:12 – 10:25)
There’s a lot of communication back and forth in New York. H&I started out there
separate from the general service structure in California because Jack Prose started H&I
separate from the structure of AA. It’s still like that today.
(10:26 – 10:32)
And I went to Jack’s memorial. He died 55 years sober just last year. We went to his
memorial.
(10:32 – 10:39)
He started H&I. And these are the people that were hanging around. It was an exciting
time.
(10:39 – 10:48)
And I have to look back on it now. Now that I’m sober, I look back, and Alcoholics
Anonymous kept my family together. They had filed for divorce, my parents.
(10:49 – 11:01)
My life would have been very different had my dad not got sober and these people got
involved in Alcoholics Anonymous. When I was about 15, it was my time. 14, 15, it was
my turn.
(11:02 – 11:15)
Now, I don’t recommend being raised in AA. There’s nothing worse than living in a house
with two people with clear eyes that know exactly what’s going on in your head. When
you’re getting ready to start your life of crime, you’re living with the wardens, you know.
(11:15 – 11:21)
It’s like, these people have been there. They know. They were waiting for me around the
corner all the time.
(11:23 – 11:35)
And when I started drinking, I did it with a vengeance. Remember waiting around for it?
Remember, find the guy that’s sleeping in the back of the gas station. You give him five
bucks, he gets you the six-pack and keeps the change.
(11:35 – 11:42)
Stuff like that. Went out actively looking for it. Man, I just know there’s people out there
having fun without me.
(11:43 – 11:50)
And I need to go find out where it is. So I started drinking. The first time I drank, I got
really drunk.
(11:50 – 12:04)
The first time I really got drunk, I threw up in my record player. Back in the old days, we
used to have these big plastic things called records. And we played them on players that
were like furniture.
(12:05 – 12:14)
And some of them had lids. So I opened the lid, puked in the record player, and closed
the lid so I wouldn’t get caught. It’s hard to do that with your CD player.
(12:18 – 12:26)
Crawled down the hallway. I was sitting in the bathroom with a trash can between my
legs because it’s coming out both ends. I raised my head up.
(12:26 – 12:35)
The bathroom door opens up. I look up and there’s my mother standing there with this
aghast expression on her face. And my father standing behind her laughing hysterically.
(12:39 – 12:57)
Both of them in their own way were saying, oh my God, it begins. By the time I was 17, I
was a bad drunk in high school. And I had a bit of a problem with authority.
(12:59 – 13:09)
We like to wear that like a badge of honor around here. We keep saying it over and over
and over again like it’s cool. It’s kind of cute when you’re 15 or 16.
(13:09 – 13:21)
When you’re 40, it’s just stupid. You know? It’s a character defect. But at 17, I had it
really bad.
(13:21 – 13:25)
I had the slouch. I had the foul mouth. I’d already been in jail.
(13:25 – 13:37)
I was in trouble. And I remember the boy’s vice principal at the high school I was going
to, I forgot to show up for a couple of weeks. And I finally showed up and he called me in
his office.
(13:37 – 13:49)
And I sat down across his desk from him with the slouch and the glare and the sneer.
And he looked at me and there was kind of a silence. And then he just said, ah, never
mind.
(13:51 – 13:59)
And when you leave the office, you act like you got away with something. But you don’t
feel good about it. I mean, I wasn’t worth yelling at.
(14:00 – 14:09)
You could tell by looking at me that I was lost. And there was no way to reel me back in.
I’m sure there were a lot of people that looked at me that way.
(14:10 – 14:16)
That’s the way I felt. I was aggressively alcoholic and drug addicted. Aggressively.
(14:16 – 14:21)
I had it tattooed on myself. I wore it like a badge of honor. It was a lifestyle.
(14:21 – 14:38)
It was a look. For the alcoholic life to seem like the only normal one. And because I
cannot differentiate the true from the false, even though I know it is injurious, it must be
your fault.
(14:39 – 14:47)
I can never take responsibility for my behavior. If I do, I can’t justify the behavior any
longer. It’s got to be your fault.
(14:47 – 15:00)
And I’ve got to construct a persona around that to make it okay. To make it all connect
together like there’s some logical thought progression going on here. And my first
persona was the rebel.
(15:00 – 15:07)
And it was the 60s. I graduated from high school in 1965. It was a great time to be
getting loaded.
(15:08 – 15:13)
Every decade since has wanted to be the 60s, you know. We were cool. We were cute.
(15:14 – 15:21)
Weren’t we cute? We were cute. It was summertime all the time. The road from Los
Angeles to San Francisco was the road to Nirvana.
(15:22 – 15:32)
Golden Gate Park was the center of the universe. They weren’t eating hitchhikers yet, so
it was safe to travel. The young ladies were discovering their sexuality.
(15:32 – 15:40)
We were helping them as best we could. And we were cute. We had flowers and hair and
stuff, you know.
(15:42 – 15:49)
We had some pretty good music. We had theme songs and anthems. We won’t be fooled
again.
(15:51 – 15:54)
We were changing the world. I love the 60s. I’m sorry I missed it, really.
(15:59 – 16:06)
Isn’t it true? We’re out there, we’re into stuff, but we’re not really there. I was getting
loaded. I was getting loaded.
(16:09 – 16:26)
I met a woman at Bass Lake on the 4th of July when the Hells Angels rode in there in
1966, and we went up to Oregon to grow our own. And I had two kids by her. By the time
I was 22 years old, I was in the Oregon State Mental Institution.
(16:27 – 16:37)
I needed a rest. Anybody else here been in a mental institution? Yo. Two blondes right in
the front, mental institution.
(16:39 – 16:50)
Only those of us that have been in the mental institution know that it’s not that bad. You
have some sparkling conversations in the mental institution. It is an eclectic crowd.
(16:52 – 17:07)
It’s a great place to look for a bride. This is being recorded, so I will say, my wife would
like me to tell you that I did not find her in the mental institution. That was the other one.
(17:10 – 17:19)
I went to my first shrink when I was 13 years old because I hated my father, which is a
requirement for being an alcoholic. You have to hate your parents. They’re handy.
(17:21 – 17:26)
It’s their fault first. And some of them, they really deserve it. It really was their fault.
(17:27 – 17:38)
And I had anger seizures, and I’d double up and spit bile out. I was in trouble. I’d get on
my bed, rock back and forth, and bang my head into the headboard, pound my fist into
walls.
(17:38 – 17:44)
I was a troubled kid. My mother took me to the shrink. I spent a year and a half there,
and it helped.
(17:44 – 17:53)
The guy helped me. I mean, he really gave me somebody that I could really talk to. And
he opened the door to my favorite subject, me.
(17:55 – 18:07)
That never-ending, bottomless pit of me. I can do it ad nauseum. I have no trouble telling
you my secrets.
(18:08 – 18:11)
I enjoy therapy. I do it well. I like it.
(18:12 – 18:25)
It’s not a struggle for me. Matter of fact, if the conversation lulls a little bit, I’ll just make
some shit up. You know, I can go sick for sick.
(18:25 – 18:33)
You get sicker, I’ll get sicker. Some of it’s true. Then I spent some time in the mental
institution.
(18:34 – 18:51)
I went to the mental institution. I got out and went back for a follow-up because I needed
more rest. At the time, when I was 22, I was sticking needles in my arm every day, doing
speed and heroin and taking lots of acid and smoking dope and drinking like a fish.
(18:51 – 18:55)
I lost that family to divorce. I lost a house. I lost cars.
(18:56 – 19:09)
I lost several jobs. I was essentially living in my car. You know it’s not immediately
obvious when you’re living in your car? You’re just kind of going from party to party, you
know? And you fall asleep there once in a while.
(19:10 – 19:23)
And it’s no problem when somebody asks you where you live or what your address is
because you realize then, I don’t have an address, you know? But there I was at 22 in the
mental institution. I needed you then. I needed you then.
(19:25 – 19:37)
When I was sober in AA, I used to have a prejudice against young people in AA until I
finally realized, I’m jealous. God, if I’d only come in when I was 22. Geez.
(19:38 – 19:54)
I needed it when I was 17 or 18. If you want to hold on to your prejudices in AA, don’t
sponsor people. Keep those people that you’re prejudiced against on the other side of
the room because as soon as you get to know them, you’re screwed.
(19:55 – 20:00)
You realize they’re you. And what you hate in them is what you hate in yourself.
Whatever it is.
(20:02 – 20:13)
So as soon as some young kid asked me to sponsor him and I heard his story, I went,
that’s why he’s here. He’s a mess. You know? Geez.
(20:13 – 20:24)
Yeah, I’ll help you. So after the mental institution, sometime later I spent two and a half
years in group therapy. I saw several other shrinks.
(20:24 – 20:35)
I’ve been observed in jail. You ever been observed? And I’ve been gestalted and rolfed
and primal screamed. I know more about myself than it’s safe to know, actually.
(20:37 – 20:48)
So at 37, when it was time for me to get sober, I called my mother. No one loves you like
your mother. I had gotten remarried.
(20:48 – 21:03)
I had two more kids. I came back down to Los Angeles and it was normal. What normal
is, is you gotta quit shooting dope because you can’t get anybody to go along with the
concept of social heroin use.
(21:05 – 21:15)
It just doesn’t fly. You know? You can’t take acid anymore because you gotta talk to
people. So what you do is you drink on the weekends.
(21:15 – 21:26)
And the reason you only drink on the weekends is because normal people have jobs. And
when I drink, I don’t show up no matter what. So you can only drink on the weekends.
(21:26 – 21:32)
What you do during the week is smoke pot. It’s not really drugs. It’s like green and from
God.
(21:34 – 21:42)
It’s what you do in between getting really high. It’s just maintenance. Because there has
to be some cushion between you and me.
(21:42 – 21:50)
The impact of your personality on me is just absolutely devastating. And I need some
cushion. I can’t just have naked blood ever.
(21:51 – 22:00)
Ever. And as you can imagine, the experiment failed miserably. But I drank for another
15 years after the thing in the last 22.
(22:02 – 22:12)
So I called my mother, and she came and got me. This woman that was 30-some years in
Al-Anon by this time. And she took me to a place in Costa Mesa called Starting Point.
(22:13 – 22:32)
Because I could not imagine just coming to AA, sitting in the meetings and not drinking. I
couldn’t imagine it. Could you? Can you? I mean, when you’re drinking, even though you
know it’s killing you, can you imagine life without drinking? I couldn’t imagine it.
(22:33 – 22:44)
I couldn’t. The level of my sincerity was I knew the alcohol was killing me, but I hid the
marijuana and the cocaine because I knew I would need it when I got out. That’s how
sincere I was.
(22:45 – 22:54)
That’s how sincere I was. So she checked me in this place, and I spent 35 days in there.
While I was in there, they made me wear a sign around my neck.
(22:55 – 23:06)
I had to make the sign. We made it in crafts. It was a rectangular piece of cardboard with
a string on it, and it said, I am not a counselor.
(23:12 – 23:33)
Because evidently there was some confusion. But that place did me a favor. It separated
me from that kind of mind-altering chemical for 35 days, the first time since I was 15
years old that that happened.
(23:36 – 23:50)
Sober is a raw experience, isn’t it? Isn’t it strange? Sober is weird. I mean, I’ve taken a lot
of acid, and sober is weird. You know? Just weird.
(23:52 – 24:03)
I look like I’m grown up, you know? I’m a big guy. I’m middle-aged. I know how to cry at
poignant beer commercials.
(24:04 – 24:21)
So that makes me sensitive. You know? And you’re looking at me, and you’re saying
things to me, sometimes in the presence of a psychiatrist or a group facilitator or
something. You’re saying things to me like, he’s not emotionally available for me.
(24:23 – 24:42)
Has anybody ever said that to you? You know what they mean by that, and what they
think is going on, is that I have something that they want, and I’m withholding it. The
truth is, I don’t have it. You’re trying to get blood out of a turnip.
(24:43 – 24:52)
I don’t have it. I don’t have what you need from me. You want me to be emotionally
available for you? I have no emotional life.
(24:53 – 25:19)
The depth of my shallowness knows no bounds. On a good day, on a good day, I have
the emotional development of a 15 or 16-year-old who is pissed off. This is not your
honor student, 15 or 16-year-old, that comes home from school every day.
(25:20 – 25:29)
This is a troubled 15-year-old, and he’s 37. He can’t feel you. I can’t feel what you feel.
(25:30 – 25:47)
At 37 years old, I lived in a house, I had gotten married again, I had two more kids, and I
had no emotional connection to another living human being. And I didn’t even know that
until I was three or four years sober. Because the eye can’t see itself.
(25:47 – 25:59)
I don’t know those things. I’m nodding my head when you’re saying this to me, and I’m,
yes, dear, I’ll do better, you bet, uh-huh. You know, because I know what you mean, I
know what you’re trying to get, and I know I should be there, but I don’t have it.
(26:00 – 26:14)
If you stick around for 10 years or so, and if I do some things, maybe I’ll get something
like that. But I can’t speed this thing up. I’m not going to work a step and be emotionally
balanced in my first five or six years sober.
(26:14 – 26:24)
It isn’t going to happen. So now, I’ve come out of the hospital, and I’ve got to go to AA
now. I’ve got to go to AA, because I’ll tell you something.
(26:24 – 26:35)
When the insurance money all runs out, and when they’re all done gestalting and rolfing,
they send us to the world’s aftercare program, AA. This is it. There’s nowhere else to go.
(26:35 – 26:46)
This is the last house on the street. Don’t screw up. Metal folding chairs, linoleum floors
for the rest of our natural lives.
(26:47 – 27:01)
Party! Remember the party? Remember, the whole idea was to have a party. Remember
that? Remember, the whole idea was to have a few drinks, get out of the house, maybe
get lucky. You never know.
(27:02 – 27:16)
Have some adventures. I don’t know about you, but I ended up naked in my living room
watching religious television, taking notes. Party! And now I’m in AA.
(27:18 – 27:23)
Oh, AA. AA. My old man’s club.
(27:25 – 27:37)
First meeting I went to was the gong show at the Hermosa Beach Alano Club. I’m
standing in the back of the room. You’re all walking up to the podium, taking these little
metal keychain things, saying, I’d like to thank God and my sponsor for my sobriety.
(27:39 – 27:45)
And then the coup de grace. In California, we do this. The coup de grace is, happy
birthday to you.
(27:45 – 28:02)
I remember standing in the back of the room looking at my shoes thinking, I can’t do
this. This has offered me a level of lameness that I didn’t know was available. You know?
I can’t, I can’t, no.
(28:04 – 28:10)
Because you see, I’m hip. I’m from the 60s, you know. I’m hip.
(28:11 – 28:18)
Now picture this. I’m fat, bald, and 40. And I think I’m hip.
(28:22 – 28:30)
Around here, we talk a lot about denial. In order to be in denial, you have to know some
shit first. I’m not in denial.
(28:30 – 28:36)
I’m deluded. I haven’t even worked my way up to denial. When you get in denial, you’re
getting better.
(28:38 – 28:43)
I think I’m hip. My life is a complete disaster. My business is failing.
(28:43 – 29:01)
My wife is getting ready to leave me and take the kids. I’m in AA, and I’m too hip for AA. I
mean, there’s nothing sadder in my mind to watch somebody trying to be cool in, of all
places, Alcoholics Anonymous.
(29:01 – 29:12)
Of all places. So now I’m in your world. Now I’m out of the hospital, and I’m in your world.
(29:12 – 29:17)
This is your world. This is not my reality. I didn’t make this up.
(29:17 – 29:21)
I’m in your world now. And I’m lost. I don’t know what to do.
(29:21 – 29:26)
I don’t know where to go. And I’m getting ready to leave. Every day I get up, I’m getting
ready to leave.
(29:27 – 29:33)
I don’t know anybody. I go to the meetings. You all people look like you all go home
together after the meetings.
(29:34 – 29:50)
You’re all cute, and you’re all happy, and you’re talking about God and stupid shit, and I
can’t do any of this, and I’m really hip, and I’m scared, and I’m frightened, and I’m alone,
and I don’t know what I’m going to do. So I know I’ve got to get one of these sponsor
things. Because you’ve got to have a sponsor thing.
(29:51 – 29:59)
They tell you that, you know. So I walk up to this guy, and I ask him to be my sponsor,
and he says, I’ll meet you at the Hermosa Beach Aulano Club Monday. Be there at 8
o’clock.
(29:59 – 30:10)
The meeting starts at 8.30. Be there at 8, and we’ll talk about it. So I figure, this is going
to be the pre-interview. This is where he asked me a series of questions in order to get a
feel for my case.
(30:10 – 30:21)
How would I know that it was going to be any different? When you’re a kid growing up in
AA, it’s not like you’re working the steps, you know. I mean, you know what it looks like,
but you don’t know what’s inside of it. So I figure, this is what’s going to happen.
(30:21 – 30:29)
Because in the hospital thing, all they did was therapy, therapy, therapy, read the book,
therapy, therapy, therapy, read the book. And they worked me up to a fifth step. So I
figured, I was done with the steps.
(30:30 – 30:43)
It was no big deal, you know. So this guy takes me around the corner of the Aulano Club,
and he asks me a couple of questions. He says, are you willing to go to any length for
victory over alcohol? Well, I’m not stupid.
(30:44 – 30:51)
I’m not going to stand there and go, no, I just assume lose, thank you. No. You know,
there’s lots of new people in here.
(30:51 – 31:00)
If any of them ask you this, just say yes, because you have no idea what they’re talking
about. So I told them, yeah, me and you, dude, victory. That’s what I want.
(31:01 – 31:08)
Off into the sunset, bro. Victory, yeah. The second thing he said to me was more of a
statement.
(31:08 – 31:16)
than a question. He said, I noticed that when you identify yourself, you call yourself an
alcoholic and an addict. I said, yeah, I’m from the 60s, you know.
(31:19 – 31:40)
I did a lot of dope, and they taught me to do that in the hospital. So what? And he says,
well, I might suggest to you, if you’re calling yourself an addict because you think it’s a
little hipper, slicker, and cooler, you might want to drop it and be like everybody else for
the first time in your life. This is Alcoholics Anonymous.
(31:43 – 32:19)
I can remember standing there in the dark looking down at him because he’s a short
little… He’s ten years younger than me, and he’s got a full head of hair, all of which
pisses me off. And what was standing before me that night was every cop that I ever
yelled at, the boys vice principal at the high school, my mother and my father, any
authority teachers, all of them were standing there in front of me. And I could feel the
bile come up from my stomach and burn in my throat and my veins and my neck throb
back and forth.
(32:20 – 32:47)
And what was going on in my head was, who the hell do you think you are to talk to me
like that? And what came out of my mouth was, okay. It’s like when you’re fat, bald, and
40, and you’re in your old man’s club, there’s no more debate. There’s no argument.
(32:48 – 32:58)
There’s nowhere else to go. I remember leaving the Alano club one night because you
pissed me off. I’m heading for my car and I had a moment of clarity.
(32:58 – 33:09)
I go, where are you going, Bill? Where are you going to go? Because there’s nowhere to
go. There’s nowhere left to go. I remember driving home that night thinking, this is going
to be hard.
(33:10 – 33:45)
How did he know? How did he know I was trying to be special? How did he know?
Because the last thing I want to be is a garden variety drunk like my old man. I mean, at
least being a drug addict’s contemporary, you know? It’s like rock and roll and shit, you
know? How did he know I was trying to be special? And I have to remind myself, too, that
the way I ended up in the mental institution is I called the police on myself. You know,
when Alcoholics Anonymous there really are no issues, so we have to make stuff up in
order to have something to talk about.
(33:46 – 33:59)
There seems to be an issue that there’s this alcoholic addict thing, sometimes it rears its
head, and people say, well, there’s no difference. Well, everyone knows there’s a
difference. Anybody that’s been out on the street knows there’s a difference.
(33:59 – 34:09)
I know there’s a difference. No self-respecting drug addict would ever call the police on
himself. But an alcoholic will do it and think it’s a pretty good idea.
(34:10 – 34:25)
You know? I mean, there’s a level of lameness in the alcoholic that simply doesn’t exist
in the drug addict. And I finally came to terms with the fact that I grew up in a
psychedelic era. And I like dope, so what? But I’m an alcoholic.
(34:25 – 34:28)
I’m an alcoholic. I’m NAA. I’m an alcoholic.
(34:29 – 34:37)
Everybody has to find their home. Do I qualify for other things? Yeah, but I’m an
alcoholic. But I want to be different.
(34:37 – 34:44)
I want to have one of those special programs. And this guy picked up on that right away.
The very first thing he said to me was something shitty.
(34:46 – 34:52)
He says, be at my house Thursday at five o’clock. Read the doctor’s opinion. Make notes
in the margin about what you agree with and what you don’t agree with.
(34:53 – 35:01)
So I went and I did my homework. Now, I thought all of you were doing this. I thought all
of you were going to class.
(35:02 – 35:09)
I showed up there at his house. I’d done my homework and I made my notes in the
margin. He didn’t trust me that I’d read it, so he had me sit there and read it to him out
loud.
(35:10 – 35:19)
And we discussed my, and I had a lot of objections to it. There was shit I didn’t agree
with, you know, because I’m a thinker. And we discussed it.
(35:19 – 35:27)
He gave me air time. We discussed it. I didn’t know that there’s people you could ask to
be their sponsor and they’d say, well, yeah, sure, read the book.
(35:27 – 35:33)
Call me if you need some help. I didn’t know that. I didn’t know that there were people
around here that didn’t know what the hell they were talking about.
(35:33 – 35:39)
You know, I thought everybody was going to class. And that’s what I did. This guy
brought me into his world.
(35:40 – 35:52)
He brought me into his Alcoholics Anonymous. He had enough strength and conviction to
tell me where I was, to read the book with me because he’d read it before. And he’d
worked the steps with people before.
(35:52 – 36:03)
And we read the book once a week. We read a chapter in the book and he took me
through the process of the 12 steps and he did it with me. Now, I can control the
experience here.
(36:03 – 36:13)
I can come into this world, into your world, and I can control what happens to me. I can
pick and choose what I will and won’t do. I can hang on to my own free will.
(36:14 – 36:26)
Because I don’t want to be a sheep. My friend Paul Billings says, well, if we all got to be
sheep, get in the center of the pack because the wolves pick the weak ones off around
the outside. And I thought, God, that’s horrible.
(36:26 – 36:32)
I don’t want to be a sheep. I want to be a wolf. You know? I’m a sheep.
(36:32 – 36:35)
I’m an AA. Your world. Your program.
(36:38 – 36:50)
When I was six months sober, he says, go down and sign up on the 12-step list at the
central office. You cannot be a member of Alcoholics Anonymous if you’re not on the 12-
step list. I figured that’s where they handed out the ID cards.
(36:51 – 36:57)
So I ran right down there and, you know, signed up. When I did my fifth step, he went
around and told everybody, you can talk to him now. He’s okay.
(36:59 – 37:06)
You know? He’s a member. I go, what do you mean? He says, you’re a member now. And
I thought, the only requirement, he goes, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
(37:06 – 37:13)
That’s just what we tell people to kind of lull them into a feeling of confidence. You want
to belong here. You’ve got to do some shit and you’ve done it.
(37:13 – 37:21)
You’ve done your fifth step. You’re part of what’s going on. Let me tell you about the
path.
(37:22 – 37:30)
Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed the path. The path is
about 30 feet wide. It’s light brown raked gravel.
(37:30 – 37:40)
And on either side of the path is little white painted rocks. On the other side of the rocks
is the jungle. Now, we’re all familiar with the jungle.
(37:40 – 37:48)
I’m out in the jungle and I’m swinging through the trees. I’ve got my loincloth on, my
quiver full of arrows and my bow. I know where all the trails and watering holes are.
(37:48 – 37:55)
I’m doing pretty good out in the jungle. After a while, the loincloth is a little ripped and
torn. The arrows are all gone.
(37:55 – 38:03)
Somebody’s ripped off my bow. And the lions and tigers are closing in. So I come running
out of the jungle.
(38:03 – 38:11)
Running for my life. And I come out onto this beautiful meadow. And it’s sunny and warm
in the meadow.
(38:11 – 38:16)
It’s easy to walk around. There’s no trees in the way and stuff. And it’s really comfortable
in the meadow.
(38:17 – 38:24)
And the lions and tigers don’t like to come out into the meadow during the daylight. So
they stay back. So I feel like I’m safe in the meadow.
(38:25 – 38:34)
So I’m walking around in the meadow. And I stumble across the path. This great big wide
path.
(38:35 – 38:44)
And there’s only one path. There aren’t a bunch of different paths that I have to pick
from. There’s just this one big all-inclusive path.
(38:45 – 38:59)
And there’s no confusion as to which way to go because there’s a whole bunch of people
on the path going that way. So I’ve been given the gift of the meadow. No charge.
(39:00 – 39:08)
The moment of clarity. I’m in the meadow. But I have to choose to step over the rocks
and get on the path.
(39:09 – 39:16)
Everybody gets the meadow. Everybody gets the meadow. Not everybody gets the path.
(39:17 – 39:27)
We keep ourselves from the path. We sit in the back of the room and we talk about those
people. And those meetings.
(39:28 – 39:32)
I’m not going to a men’s stag. I don’t care what they say. I don’t like it there.
(39:33 – 39:39)
And we pick and choose what we will and won’t do. We govern the experience. That
keeps us off the path.
(39:40 – 39:46)
The path has nothing to do with my choice. What I will and won’t do. I either get on it or I
don’t.
(39:48 – 39:59)
Now on a good day if I’m on the path and I see you on the other side of the rocks I might
reach over and say hey, come on. You want to come on the path? So you get on the
path. I get on the path.
(39:59 – 40:09)
I’m walking along. If you’re on the path with us it really helps if you keep up because if
you slow down we start banging into you and stuff, you know. And if you fall down we’ll
reach down and help you up.
(40:09 – 40:17)
Mostly to get you out of the way. But we’ll help. So we’re all walking along the path
smoking cigarettes, drinking coffee, having a gay old time.
(40:18 – 40:23)
Every once in a while some guy will do a strange thing. He’s on the path. He steps back
over the rocks.
(40:23 – 40:33)
He’s walking along the side of the path in this low brushy area. He’s still walking along
with us but it’s kind of harder going now. We look over there and go what the hell is he
doing over there? With her.
(40:47 – 41:05)
But we don’t give it a lot of energy because we’ve all been over there. Then there’s some
people that wander further away from the path and they get out into this area where
there’s like small diameter birch trees. Now they’re starting to bang into trees and fall
down and stuff.
(41:06 – 41:14)
And these people they do a weird thing. They pick up rocks and throw them at the
people on the path. So we line the newcomers up along the edge.
(41:20 – 41:28)
And they’re real loud when they’re throwing these rocks. They say well it’s a cult, you
know. It is kind of a cult, isn’t it? I shaved my head.
(41:31 – 41:36)
It is kind of culty, isn’t it? When you’re in it. When you’re in it. When you’re on the field.
(41:36 – 41:45)
Not just up on the stands being a fan. But when you’re in it. Because when you’re in it
when you hear those people take the chips it isn’t so lame, is it? Because you know
them.
(41:46 – 41:53)
And when you hear somebody sing a happy birthday for some guy maybe you helped
him a little bit. Maybe he helped you. All of a sudden you can hear the music.
(41:54 – 41:59)
It’s not so lame anymore. It’s pretty cool. Your heart starts to open up.
(41:59 – 42:03)
You soften up. You lame up. You become part of AA.
(42:04 – 42:14)
Then it’s kind of culty. We’ve got secret handshakes and special underwear and
everything, man. And it’s really easy to get in with the cult.
(42:14 – 42:18)
All you’ve got to do is just step over the rocks. Walk up and ask for help. Quit being cool.
(42:19 – 42:30)
Stop being cool. If you’re sitting out in this audience tonight and you’re sober a few years
and you don’t feel connected it’s because you’re not. It’s not some neurotic problem.
(42:31 – 42:38)
You don’t need any psychotherapy about it. You’re not connected because you’re not
doing it. All you’ve got to do is ask.
(42:39 – 42:46)
I’m getting tired of going to the funerals. I’m getting tired of trying to talk to you. Asking
you what’s wrong and there’s never anything wrong.
(42:46 – 42:57)
But why are you sitting alone? There’s a lot of untreated alcoholism inside of Alcoholics
Anonymous. It isn’t just the newcomers. There’s a lot of people who’ve been around here
a lot of years and they’ve never done it.
(42:57 – 43:03)
Never done it. Most people in AA don’t do the inventory. Very few people actually make
the amends.
(43:04 – 43:21)
And if you’re in that space where you’ve done a little life story maybe and apologized to
mom and you’re wondering why you don’t feel good I can explain it to you in detail. If
you haven’t made the amends you’re on the saloon side of the ninth step. The psychic
change comes after the ninth step.
(43:22 – 43:37)
You ever heard people in Alcoholics Anonymous say the longer I’m sober the less I know?
Don’t you wonder about those people? Don’t ask them anything. They don’t know
anything. I know a hell of a lot more about how to live sober now than I did when I came
in here 18 years ago.
(43:39 – 43:47)
Bill Wilson says that it takes a message that has depth and weight to help the alcoholic.
Depth and weight. He says a real powerful thing after the ninth step.
(43:47 – 44:01)
He says our next function is to increase in understanding and effectiveness. I don’t think
that’s the longer I’m sober the less I know. If you’re not sponsoring people in Alcoholics
Anonymous and you’ve been here for a while you are not doing AA.
(44:01 – 44:14)
You’re not doing it. If you believe the lie that some things are for some people and some
are for others you’re controlling the experience. I used to stand up here and say people
on medication weren’t sober.
(44:15 – 44:29)
You know why? Because I heard you say it and I wanted to be a right wing death squad
AA dude. Then a guy came up to me and asked me to help him and he says I’m bipolar
and I’m on medication. Well see I’ve been told I don’t get to turn anybody away.
(44:29 – 44:41)
I’m pretty arrogant but I am not arrogant enough to determine if you’re correctly
alcoholic enough for me to work with. That’s arrogant. So I said okay we’ll talk about that
later let’s do the deal.
(44:42 – 45:00)
I’ve known this guy for a few years and I’ve had to peel him off the ceiling and lift him up
off the floor. Now when I see him come and I say have you taken your medication?
Because you’re sick you know. So I had an experience and I had an opinion.
(45:00 – 45:13)
And the experience changed my opinion. All newcomers are bipolar and the medical
profession is trying to medicate all of us. But some people really have the disease.
(45:14 – 45:24)
Some people have the demon. You ever seen the demon? You ever seen the demon in
the eye of somebody that wants to stop drinking and they can’t? That’s the demon. The
demon takes many forms many shapes.
(45:24 – 45:34)
Resentment, anger, hostility. The fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous is something to be
survived You people won’t keep me sober. You’re guaranteed to piss me off.
(45:35 – 45:43)
I need something bigger than the fellowship in order to help it work for me. I need some
principles. I need something deeper than that.
(45:43 – 45:47)
If all I’ve got is you you’re human. You’ll fail me. You’re guaranteed.
(45:47 – 46:01)
If all you have is me I will fail you. I’m guaranteed to fail you. The other thing that people
say in the trees is they say as they’re throwing their rocks they say I’m going to take
care of myself now.
(46:02 – 46:11)
Like what the hell have you been doing? These are the same people that say well I do
this and I don’t do that. I don’t sponsor people. There’s too much ego in it.
(46:11 – 46:21)
Well what the hell do you do then? Why do you think we’re here? We’re here to save the
brothers and sisters. There’s no other reason for us to be here. There is no other reason.
(46:21 – 46:26)
This is not a self-help group. This is not a support group. It has very little to do with me.
(46:26 – 46:37)
It has everything to do with you. I finally get relief from the bottomless pit of me because
it never ends. If you ever catch yourself alone in a room thinking about yourself get the
hell out of the room.
(46:39 – 46:48)
You’re in the wrong place. Go help somebody else think about themselves. Reach out to
somebody.
(46:48 – 46:58)
Drive them to a meeting. I’ve had guys come back to me and say I want to do another
inventory and I go hell no man I’m tired of listening to you. Go help somebody else do
their inventory.
(46:58 – 47:05)
If you’re sponsoring people if you’re working with others you’ll always be in the book.
You’ll never get out of the book. You’ll always be in the inventory process.
(47:05 – 47:12)
You’ll always be making amends. It’ll never end because you’re helping other people do
it. You’re saving souls and saving lives.
(47:13 – 47:32)
This is the single most significant social movement of the 20th century Alcoholics
Anonymous. It has touched the lives of over 300 million people statistically with all the
A’s the Al-Anon N-A-C-A-O-A all the A’s. We, you and I are privileged to be in an
organization where people’s lives are saved every day.
(47:33 – 47:39)
And you know how they’re saved? It’s me. I am the instrument of God’s will. I am
Alcoholics Anonymous.
(47:40 – 47:50)
If I don’t say the words they don’t get heard. If they come up and ask me for help and
I’ve got something else to do they die. I am Alcoholics Anonymous.
(47:51 – 47:54)
You are Alcoholics Anonymous. You are the message. You don’t carry it.
(47:54 – 48:01)
You are the message. Do it aggressively. You want your life to change? Don’t monitor the
phone when it rings.
(48:02 – 48:09)
Just pick it up. What are you hiding from? Somebody asks you for help? Bring them
home. Let them see how you live.
(48:09 – 48:25)
What are you hiding from? Do you walk the walk? Do you talk the talk? Do you have a
talk to walk? What are you doing here? Is there a purpose for you to be here? Stop and
think about it. We all have to ask ourselves that question. I don’t ever get to say no.
(48:25 – 48:31)
I just go. I’ve allowed myself to be swept away by this thing. And my life has changed.
(48:31 – 48:39)
It’s unbelievable. God sends me you. God lives in the space between you and I. The
closer I am to you the closer I am to God.
(48:39 – 49:01)
I’m on a mission from God. And I’m a little evangelical about it. Can you tell? Can you see
the light in my eyes? If you don’t like what I had to say blame God.
(49:03 – 49:11)
I’d like to close with something. I know I’m going on a little bit here but this means an
awful lot to me and I’d like to close with this. This is a poem written by Sam Shoemaker.
(49:12 – 49:22)
Sam Shoemaker was the minister of Calvary Church when Ebby Thatcher came to talk to
Bill Wilson when he was 60 days sober. 60 days sober. He was on his 12-step call.
(49:22 – 49:29)
These guys work their steps in a day, maybe two. Working the steps of AA is 20% of the
program. That’s it.
(49:29 – 49:36)
If you’re three or four years sober and you’re on your fourth or fifth inventory throw it
away. You’ve missed the point. You’ve missed the point.
(49:37 – 49:43)
It’s not about you. It’s not about inventory after inventory after inventory. It’s about
helping others.
(49:43 – 49:53)
You’ve got to do the 20% to clear the decks so you can do the 80% which is working with
others. So Ebby came to Bill then Ebby left. Bill went looking for Ebby.
(49:53 – 50:00)
Ebby was down at Calvary Chapel. Shoemaker was the minister of Calvary Chapel. He
was the big gun of the Oxford group in the United States.
(50:01 – 50:12)
Wilson became very close to Shoemaker when he wanted to write the big book when he
wanted to write the 12 steps he went to Shoemaker and asked him to do it. Shoemaker
in his brilliance said no Bill this is your gig. You do it.
(50:12 – 50:25)
I’ll help but you do it. Shoemaker wrote this poem and it wasn’t written about AA but I
believe this is the heart and soul of Alcoholics Anonymous. This is why we’re here.
(50:25 – 50:30)
You listen to this. You tell me if you don’t feel the same way. I stand by the door.
(50:30 – 50:39)
I neither go too far in nor stay too far out. The door is the most important door in the
world. It is the door through which men walk when they find God.
(50:40 – 51:02)
There is no use my going way inside and staying there when so many are still outside
and they as much as I crave to know where the door is. All that so many ever find is only
the wall where the door ought to be. They creep along the wall like blind men with
outstretched groping hands feeling for a door knowing there must be a door yet they
never find it.
(51:04 – 51:24)
So I stand by the door. The most tremendous thing in the world is for men to find that
door the door to God. The most important thing that any man can do is to take hold of
one of those blind groping hands and put it on the latch the latch that only clicks and
opens to the man’s own touch.
(51:25 – 51:47)
Men die outside the door as starving beggars die on cold nights in cruel cities in the dead
of winter die for want of what was within their grasp. They live on the other side of it live
because they’ve not found it. Nothing else matters compared to helping them find it and
open it and walk in and find Him.
(51:47 – 52:00)
So I stand by the door. I admire the people that go way in but I wish they would not
forget how it was before they got in. Then they would be able to help the people who
have not yet even found the door.
(52:01 – 52:22)
Or the people who want to run away again from God. You could go in too deeply and stay
in too long and forget the people outside the door. As for me, I shall take my old
accustomed place near enough to God to hear Him and know He is there but not so far
from men as to not hear them and remember that they are there too.
(52:23 – 52:29)
Where? Outside the door. Thousands of them. Millions of them.
(52:29 – 52:35)
But more important for me, one of them. Two of them. Ten of them.
(52:36 – 52:44)
Whose hands I am intended to put on the latch. So I shall stand by the door and wait for
those who seek it. I’d rather be a doorkeeper.
(52:45 – 52:48)
So we stand by the door. Thank you very much.